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Rules Questions - Undead/Khemri/Necro coaches, Regen & Arguing the Call

Indigo - Jan 27, 2005 - 10:02 AM
Post subject: Undead/Khemri/Necro coaches, Regen & Arguing the Call

A recent discussion prompted a furious search through the rules to try and clarify this...

If a Necro/Khemri/Undead coach argues the call and fails, sending the coach off too, do these teams lose their Regen ability? I've looked through the rules and nowhere does it specifically state this. Furthermore, the ability is specifically attached to the players, like Trolls too. Fluff wise it might make sense but rules wise it's not the case.

So, what do others think of this?

Spazzfist - Jan 27, 2005 - 10:28 AM
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I seem to recall reading somehwere that if the coach is sent off that the undead teams do lose their ability to regeanrate as it is dependant upon their head coach. I do not have my book with me here, but will look it up later.

Spazz

KarlLagerbottom - Jan 27, 2005 - 10:47 AM
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I think a search of Galak's posts here will cover this. If I remember correctly, and that is by no means certain, the Undead team somehow retains their ability to Raise Dead and Regen, but the 'Flings lose their Master Chef ability. (If this happens before the begining of the second half.)

Galak...can you confirm?

-Rob

Deathwing - Jan 27, 2005 - 10:48 AM
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I can't find anything in the rules to prevent either raising the dead or regen if a necromancer is ejected. If people argue that that is indeed the case, ask them where it says so. Smile

This confusion probably dates way back to the Q&A in WD187:

"Q: The 'Sorry' and 'Sorry' sir special play cards can result in a team's head coach (i.e. me!) getting killed. Is this correct? And if it is, what effect does it have?

Yes, these cards can be used against Head Coaches. If the Head Coach is injured or killed then he may not argue the call for the rest of the match (and Undead Necromancers may not use their 'Raise The Dead' spell either)...[snip]..Undead teams that lose their Necromancer Head Coach can carry on playing, but none of the players in the team are allowed to Regenerate as this function is performed by the Head Coach rather than the players themselves. The Necromancer will be replaced in time for the next match in the same way as a normal Head Coach."

So unless I've missed something, people are remembering a 10 year old Q&A and equating 'killed/injured' by now defunct cards with 'ejected' in the current rules.

Deathwing - Jan 27, 2005 - 10:59 AM
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KarlLagerbottom wrote:

After a brief search:

GalakStarscraper wrote:

Gertwise wrote:

It's on the reference sheet, but I don't see it in the LRB.

Also, along those lines, wasn't there something somewhere about undead not being able to regenerate if the Necromancer was kicked out of the game?

That's been removed from the game permantently.

Galak

Spazzfist - Jan 27, 2005 - 11:52 AM
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I think that the problem here is that I am such an "old git" - in that I have been playing the game for so long - I think that I migt be recalling an older ruleset that did have that rule!

Melifaxis - Jan 27, 2005 - 12:14 PM
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Raide Dead wouldn't work though as the head coach does the raising. Regen is now a physical proprty of the player in question.

Doubleskulls - Jan 27, 2005 - 03:36 PM
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There are only 2 effects of getting ejected.

1) You can't argue the call
2) Master Chef's stop working

The necromancer in uneffected.

Babs - Jan 27, 2005 - 09:03 PM
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Ian, Where does it state that the Master Chef stops working if the Head Coach is ejected???

Bevan - Jan 27, 2005 - 10:17 PM
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Babs wrote:

Ian, Where does it state that the Master Chef stops working if the Head Coach is ejected???

If you pay for a wizard etc. then he is separate from the coach. If the Wizard effect is an automatic function of the "Head coach" then you don't pay extra to get it, but the function should stop if the Head Coach is ejected.

So under rules in which the Master Chef is purchased he keeps working when the coah is ejected, but under rules in which the team gets one for free he could be susceptible to ejection.

I'm not sure why the same would not apply to a necromancer for undead, but it would not affect teams that have regenerating players such as Trolls and have a normal head coach (assuming any Blood Bowl coach can be considered "normal").

TuernRedvenom - Jan 28, 2005 - 12:19 AM
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Babs wrote:

Ian, Where does it state that the Master Chef stops working if the Head Coach is ejected???

LRB page 28 wrote:

...roll a D6 before each half if the head coach (ie, Master Chef) has not been ejected

Melifaxis - Jan 28, 2005 - 08:39 AM
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Hmm...I don't see it anywhere but we've always played it that way. If the coach is ejected how can he create a zombie during the game? Should get added/clarified.

Mordredd - Jan 28, 2005 - 09:57 AM
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Isn't the coach ejected from the game (read the pitch) and confined to the dug out rather than expelled from the stadium altogether?

If so why would the Necromancer's magic not work just because he's not allowed on the pitch?

And the Necromancers spell is usually useless for the largest part of a teams life (i.e. they usually have 16 players on the roster) so there's no need to dream up new ways to stop him doing anything. Conversely the Master Chef will always be useful to a Halfling team unless it has 8 re rolls and its opponent has none at all.

Doubleskulls - Jan 28, 2005 - 02:58 PM
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TuernRedvenom got it right - its in the main LRB rules under master chefs.

TBH I don't see why any further consequences of getting sent off are a good idea.