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Rules Questions - Bouncing balls - how many times and when and from where?!!!
bunnygirl - Aug 03, 2005 - 01:14 PM
Post subject: Bouncing balls - how many times and when and from where?!!!
Ok, so I'm confused, forgive me!
Kick off - you scatter the ball and move it D6 in that direction. Do you then bounce only once, or should it be 3 times?
Failed pass - 3 bounces, and can you try to catch it before the last bounce?
If you manage to knock someone down, does the ball scatter from the space they were in before, or the space you push them back to?
If you so happen to be in the right space when someone drops the ball, is your catch modified as for a bouncing ball or not?
Oh, and when you cause someone to drop the ball, do you scatter the ball first, or follow up first?
I just don't know anymore!!! HELP!!!
Spazzfist - Aug 03, 2005 - 01:25 PM
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Kick off - scatter d6 squares in the one direction and then it bounces once.
Failed pass - don't think of it as bouncing three times - the three scatters on the failed pass is just showing where the ball actually ends up when the thrower muffed up the pass. Should it land in an empty square it will then hit the ground and bounce once.
As for the push back/knock down, I scatter from where the player lands. To my mind as long as both players play the same way during a game (and establish it beforehand) it is fair.
To catch a ball if it scatters onto you, there is +0 modifier. Unless of course here are tackle zones, in which case you modify accordingly.
And for the last one I would say that you have to elect to follow up (or not) before scattering the ball. This would prevent an unscrupulous player from seeing where the ball scatters and then take a free follow up to potentially pick it up (which would then give him +1 to pick it up whereas a scatter would be +0)
Hope this helps (and hope even more that I am not wrong!)
Spazz
bunnygirl - Aug 03, 2005 - 01:40 PM
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It definately helps, and (thank god!) confirms what I thought for the most part - thank you!!!!!!!!
snew - Aug 03, 2005 - 02:19 PM
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I just wanted to confirm for Spazz that his answers were correct.
On a knockdown, though, always scatter the ball from the square the player is pushed to. Not only does that make sense as that's the square the player is now in, that's the way every single person I've met in all the tournaments I've gone to has interpreted that as well. Just go with the masses here.
Mordredd - Aug 03, 2005 - 03:18 PM
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On a knockdown the player is pushed back and then knocked over; pushed back first and knocked over second. You drop the ball when you're knocked over so when you drop the ball you've already been pushed back. So the correct square to scatter the ball from is where the blocked player was pushed to.
Spazzfist - Aug 03, 2005 - 04:25 PM
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Mordredd wrote:
On a knockdown the player is pushed back and then knocked over; pushed back first and knocked over second. You drop the ball when you're knocked over so when you drop the ball you've already been pushed back. So the correct square to scatter the ball from is where the blocked player was pushed to.
Right,cause this would clarify for the situations where a ball carrier is blocked with a person who has the strip ball skill. (In the case of strip ball and frenzy, I would imagine that the ball would scatter on the first push and then the second would be resolved.
But then ..... what if the frenzied player(with strip ball) hits the player and ghets a pus, the ball scatters to the attacking player who fails to catch it. A turnover? Is the second hit resolved?
Doubleskulls - Aug 03, 2005 - 08:31 PM
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Failing a catch is never a turnover in itself. Its losing possession of the ball after a pass/hand off that is the turnover.
BTW everything must be resolved before you do any bounce (i.e. follow ups and armour & injury rolls) since these could effect the final outcome (if the knocked over player is KO'd for example the ball might end up back in the same square).
GalakStarscraper - Aug 04, 2005 - 10:57 AM
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Doubleskulls wrote:
Failing a catch is never a turnover in itself.
We even added that exact sentence to the LRB 4.0 and folks still have problems with it.
Any Ian had it right ... resolve EVERYTHING before bouncing the ball.
The LRB we are working on for the Vault had the text change to make it more clear to everyone that the ball bounces from the square of the knockdown.
Galak
dmchale - Aug 20, 2005 - 08:44 PM
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by "resolve everything"... I'm still confused, in the strip ball/frenzy example, would you never strip on the first pushback since you still have a second block to make? Or would you push, move both players (blockee and the blocker following up), scatter ball, resolve what happens to it, then go on to block the 2nd time? I believe I have it right but "resolve everything" makes it sound like you should block twice and THEN scatter the ball if a strip occurred on the first (or 2nd) block.
snew - Aug 21, 2005 - 09:47 AM
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Resolve everything for the first block, scatter the ball, then make the second (compulsory) block and resolve all that .
Go ahead and make all the catch rolls after the ball scatters, before the second block.