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Rules Questions - Am I the only one who hates the handicap system?
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 07:59 AM
Post subject: Am I the only one who hates the handicap system?
here is my problem. i had a VERY bad game and a couple of good players died putting my team rating nearly 50 below some of the teams in my league. i will basically get 2 handicap rolls from now on against EVERYONE i play in our league unless they all have several very bad games and i have several very good games. the old handicap system allowed for some extra mvps which would eventually get your team rating caught up to the other teams you play against. with the current handicap table only a couple of results are even worth the effort of rolling the dice while the rest are a joke.
why does blood bowl not allow extra SPPs anymore for handicaps? and am i the only one who hates the current handicap system?
Elan - Apr 10, 2003 - 08:05 AM
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No! I hate it as well. I do not think the benefits it offers actually do much by way of redressing the differences, although there is a free MVP in there (roll a 1-4), you have to be real lucky to get it. Most of the rest is fluff to make you feel better about being beaten up.
Generally mega-teams have reams of skilled up players and reserves and the majority of the "handicaps" will not even begin to help 
Mordredd - Apr 10, 2003 - 08:09 AM
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I don't think the handicap is meant to quite even up the game, just make it possible for an occasional upset. I do think that the table lacks the variety of the old cards. It should be bigger, with more results.
Gattolardo - Apr 10, 2003 - 08:19 AM
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Mordredd wrote:
I don't think the handicap is meant to quite even up the game, just make it possible for an occasional upset. I do think that the table lacks the variety of the old cards. It should be bigger, with more results.
Absolutely true, that's why we still use the (revamped) old cards,
sobstituting the Handicap rolls with bonus cards.....
They also give the game a more "BloodBowlish" feel 
Cheers
Rob
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 08:58 AM
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Mordredd wrote:
I don't think the handicap is meant to quite even up the game, just make it possible for an occasional upset. I do think that the table lacks the variety of the old cards. It should be bigger, with more results.
well, i'm not even asking that the handicap table completely even up my game, but it would be nice to be given the chance to EVENTUALLY catch up like the old 3rd ed. system did with bonus MVPs. like i said earlier, as long as my team continues to play in this league i will probably ALWAYS get at least 1 handicap roll, most of the time 2. and that is simply because the current system offers no added way to help your team build up. and when your playing against teams that are way more skilled up than yours...you just aren't gonna catch up the natural way, at least not for a VERY long time anyway.
Doubleskulls - Apr 10, 2003 - 10:23 AM
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Its not true that you wont catch up. If you are TR 51 behind your opponents you are getting 20k more income than they are. After a few games this makes a big difference - you can replace players and they can't. There are also a few handicap results that give more money or a bonus MVP.
All that being said the current handicap rolls are far too random, with the majority of results being useless. My opponenent in my last game got the choose Weather result. 1st kick off - weather change.
Melifaxis - Apr 10, 2003 - 10:28 AM
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We might revise the handicap table after this season in our league. While it is not intended to fully catch you up, we think it needs to be a little better overall to promote parity.
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 10:44 AM
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Doubleskulls wrote:
Its not true that you wont catch up. If you are TR 51 behind your opponents you are getting 20k more income than they are.
you can't just make a blanket statement like that. you have the OPPORTUNITY to make 20k more income than your opponent. and even then with a 51 point difference, even if you DID make 20k more per game, unless you were getting significantly more SPPs than your opponent you will need 20-25 games to catch up.
my last game i rolled greased shoes(against dwarves so it didn't really matter) and bad press(all that did the entire game was give me 1 extra reroll which i didn't even use).
i would like to see an option of say for every 2 handicaps you get, you can choose to trade 1 roll for an extra MVP @ the end of the game. think about that, it is possible that if you choose to take the MVP it could go to someone who was killed in the game so there shouldn't be a lot of people that would throw a fit over you getting an extra MVP. besides the fact that if they are that much ahead of you and throw a fit over anything they are just big freakin babies to begin with...
but that's just my worthless opinion.
Agentrock - Apr 10, 2003 - 10:55 AM
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I agree that the handicap chart doesn't work. Has anyone heard if Galak's modified chart (which was posted on TBB) works better?
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 11:43 AM
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never seen it. is it on his website also? i can't get on TBB @ work for some reason.
Agentrock - Apr 10, 2003 - 12:09 PM
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I'll try to track it down...
Agentrock - Apr 10, 2003 - 12:32 PM
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Here is the link (after much frantic searching thinking that I may have been seeing things): http://www.talkbloodbowl.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5032&highlight=handicap
I'd attach the jpeg file here if I knew how... 
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 12:35 PM
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thanks, i'll check it when i get home
AnthonyTBBF - Apr 10, 2003 - 01:17 PM
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We have a modified chart as well, check it out at http://www.tbbf.org/houserules.asp
We toughened up some of the results so they had a bit more bite.
Agentrock - Apr 10, 2003 - 01:19 PM
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Great! Thanks!!
Agentrock - Apr 10, 2003 - 01:29 PM
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By the way...great website!
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 01:30 PM
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thanks anthony. love the tbbf site btw. i stole your dzn black orc model idea hope you don't mind(unfortunately, mine doesn't hurt ANYONE though).
i like making the handicap table have a bit more bit, but it still doesn't solve what i see as the core problem with it...it still just doesn't allow any "catch up" room. those are good handicaps but you would still need to play ALOT of games to make up the kind of difference that i am down in our league.
Agentrock - Apr 10, 2003 - 01:34 PM
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Yeah, I see your point...you don't gain in leaps and bounds anymore. But on the otherhand, the others that you are trailing behind won't either and in fact their progression will slow down significantly due to the worked in "penalties" for higher team ratings (ageing, loss of money on the winnings chart, etc.).
mikeyc222 - Apr 10, 2003 - 01:38 PM
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once again, they get the OPPORTUNITY to progress slower. the team i played last night was 2 points away from me getting a 3rd handicap roll and when it was all said and done their team rating went up ALOT more than mine.
raggabagga - Apr 10, 2003 - 08:45 PM
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i hate the old cards and the revamped ones. they were way to abusive, and could easily turn the tide of a game to the person w/a low team rating. i'm playing in a league now that is using cards and next season we've decided to go w/a modified handicap table very similar to the current rules. it speeds up the game and still gives a chance to the player w/the lower handicap.
Auciello - Apr 10, 2003 - 11:45 PM
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In my league, we still use the bonus MVPs.
Coaches actually try to arrange games where they can play against teams that outrank them by 101.
That's how I quickly built a great Chaos team last year.