Also, since it says that a head coach model is not needed to argue the call, it implies that one is not needed for theming purposes.

Themes - does that mean my xmas goblin team should score more points than a normal goblin team that is simply well painted in nice colours? So we're now all required to come up with some wacky overriding theme rather than simply a common uniform?

We MUST write 200 words minimum, according to the rules, or we lose points. Also, since it says that a head coach model is not needed to argue the call, it implies that one is not needed for theming purposes.

From: "Jervis Johnson"
To: BBRC
Subject: RE: Blood Bowl Rules
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 17:11:59 -0000

I'd like to draw a line under this discussion if we can. Fascinating as it is, it's the UK events team that came up with the rules pack rather than Fanatic, and I'd be loath for us to go and stick our oar in about a matter like this. To put things in context, the UK have always felt that the 'hobby' side of the hobby was something that should be emphasised strongly in their tournaments, which is why the marking system is set up the way that it is, and their remit is to provide a tournament for the *UK* market rather than a global one, which is why they are not too worried about including tests and points for team histories. If any of you have really strong issues about these things, I recommend getting in touch with the UK events team about them (their email address is on the UK website). They are really good people, and will be happy to listen to any constructive criticism, though I really doubt they are in a position to change anything at this late stage.

Best regards,

Jervis Johnson
Head Fanatic

Do we know who wrote these rules? Have they been officially published yet?

I'm still hoping that these pre-released "rules" are just a way to see how the community reacts and they will actually come up with real rules.

That sounds quite hysterical

As for coaches not being able to understand the sentence "Whch team....", according to my reliable sources Tarra's grasp of english is rudimentary at best.

And remember that when jervis was asking questions to the audience in Bugmans after the event, there was a 10 second delay as the message was translated for the spanish team, all of which did fairly well, so it kinda shows that BB skill is not related to the languages you speak

maybe this year having a spanish champ will be impossible...

Thank goodness for that. Am I right in saying that all the "Grand Slams" have been won by Spanish coaches? Everyone knows that the Spanish team is overpowered. GW are obviously trying to give the UK players a not-so-subtle helping hand. Well done GW.

To be pedantic, there is nothing that says that the theme has to be written in English... Give the judges something to think about Then again, you probably would just annoy them and get lower marks. Probably best not to do that.

Of course, you can always go and get your team done proffessionally.....as for painting and that not being a part of it - damn straight! I hate painting, BB should be about playing the game, and the winner should be the best coach, not the best know it all who either has the time or the cash to produce a brillent team.

I'm sorry, but in all the hysteria you people seem to have missed the obvious. I think that I have pointed it out twice already, but I'll do it again.

Last year the BB winner did it on strength of games alone. His painting and English skills had NOTHING to do with winning the cup. The only thing that mattered was that he was one of the top two placed coaches after round 5. I imagine it will be exactly the same this year, or does it say otherwise in the rules pack? I have yet to receive mine so I can't check this.

I can't stand playing against people who insist on using unpainted figs, paper markers on their bases, Monopoly pieces, and so on. I'm not alone. This creates an unenjoyable atmosphere of neverending "who's he" questions.

-Chet

I know GW refuses to produce non-English tourney packs, but maybe they could be persuaded to do non-English quizzes. They should be able to work out rough numbers from where they had to post the tickets. Alternatively, as an example, team Spain could do a quick headcount and then write in to ask GW's Spanish department to do a translation for them. Just a suggestion which I hope might be helpful seeing as the whole format seems to be fairly set now.

So you have a minimum painting/presentation standard for all entrants to a competition. It doesn't need to be included in the points.

And there was me thinking it was because the Events mob know squat about BB, being standard GW "WFB/40K/LotR" flunkies rather than people who actually care about the rest of us?
(maybe a touch unfair...but thats how it seems)

Torsten,

I will try and clarify for you some of the points you have raised. I
have
put my responses in capitals to distinguish them from your notes.

Brian Aderson

UK Tournaments Manager

-----Original Message-----

Hello Fanatic,
as you are probably experiencing right now, a lot of
people are not happy with the rules preview of the BB
XLIII.

I don't know the structure of Fanatic/GamesWorkshop to
know who's responsible for what, but it appears to me
that the tournament organizers don't seem to have to
much knowledge of Blood Bowl, but a lot knowledge of
Warhammer (& 40K).

The rule set shown on House-Rulez.com look very much
like the WH tournament rules. I don't know if there is
an effort to simplify the rules across all GW games,
but that doesn't seem to make much sense to me (and
others).

THE FORMAT OF THE NEW TOURNAMENT PACK IS INDEED SIMILAR TO THAT OF OTHER GAMES SYSTEMS, BUT THIS IS BECAUSE IT IS A PRACTICAL WAY TO RUN A TOURNAMENT WITH THE FACILITIES AND TIME I HAVE AVAILABLE. I HAVE WRITTEN THIS TOURNAMENT PACK AND PASSED IT ON TO THE FANATIC TEAM FOR APPROVAL AND HAVE
RECEIVED NO CRITICISM OF THE FORMAT. HOWEVER, THE MOST VALUED FEEDBACK I HAVE IS FROM THE PLAYERS IN THE EVENT ITSELF, ALTHOUGH WE ARE NOT IN A POSITION TO MAKE WHOLESALE CHANGES FOR THIS YEARS EVENT I WILL TAKE INTO ACCOUNT ANY FEEDBACK I RECEIVE AT THE WEEKEND AND TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT
WHEN REVIEWING THE RULES FOR NEXT YEAR.

I remember reading in one of the BB-Mags an acticle
from Jervis (about the new Elf team I believe) writing
about that he wanted to get away from the Warhammer
theme, because he believes that this was a mistake.
Having that in the back of my mind makes the BB 43
rule set even harder to understand.

THIS RULES SET IS IN NO WAY MOVING TOWARDS WARHAMMER OR ANY OTHER GAMES SYSTEM, IT'S SIMPLY A UNIFIED APPROACH TO A TOURNAMENT FORMAT. THIS APPROACH MAKES IT EASIER FOR STAFF & PLAYERS TO FOLLOW ACROSS A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT
EVENTS. I AM AWARE OF ALL GAMES SYSTEMS DEVELOPED BY GW AND AM OPEN TO SUGGESTIONS ON HOW I CAN CHANGE IT FOR NEXT YEAR BUT I DON'T SEE HOW SIMILARITIES TO OTHER EVENTS IN TERMS OF FORMAT IS A LEGITIMATE REASON FOR CHANGING IT. IF WHEN IT IS PLAYED, PEOPLE FIND IT DOESN'T WORK I WILL LISTEN TO THEIR CONCERNS AND TAKE IT INTO ACCOUNT WHEN THE PACK IS UPDATED, AS IT IS EVERY YEAR FOR ALL GAMES SYSTEMS.

There are a few things I would like you to reconsider
or maybe dropping me a mail and explaining what GW
thought process was behind them to make it easier to
understand.

1.) I'm all for having a differentiation between a
close victory and a blow-out, but I think one step
(win by 1TD & win by 2+TD) is sufficient to have all
players go for the higher victory, but having another
step with 3+TD in there is definatelly tough (or even
impossible) on slower and less agile teams (like e.g.
dwarves)

SEE COMMENTS ABOVE

2.) What's with the WYSIWYG, theme, squad markings and
team sheet? I believe it's Bloodbowl we are talking
about and the majority of Bloodbowl players use
miniatures which clearly show what position a player
holds. That goes the same for the markings, it should
be easy to put 11-16 numbers on each figure (same goes
for team sheet).

THESE CATEGORIES ARE THERE TO REWARD PLAYERS FOR FULFILLING THE MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS FOR ENTRY INTO THE TOURNAMENT. YES THEY ARE EASY, WHICH MEANS ALL PLAYERS SHOULD HAVE NO PROBLEMS ACHIEVING THEM AND GETTING THE MARK. THERE IS OFTEN, HOWEVER, SITUATIONS WHERE FIGURES DO NOT HAVE THEIR TEAM
NUMBER OR AREN'T ALL PAINTED IN THE SAME TEAM COLOURS, IT IS THESE SITUATIONS WHERE POINTS WILL BE DROPPED. THIS IS A WAY TO ENSURE THAT PLAYERS PRESENT A TEAM AND A TEAM SHEET THAT WILL NOT DECEIVE OR CONFUSE THEIR OPPONENT BECAUSE ALL PLAYERS AND EQUIPMENT ARE CLEARLY MARKED AND IDENTIFIED.

I don't know much about the theme
part, but reading something about writing a short
essay about the team history and stuff is not what I
expect to do when I go to play a game of Blood Bowl.

QUITE HONESTLY, THIS SECTION IS A BIT OF FUN TO GET EVERYBODY INTO THE THEME OF THEIR TEAM. IF THE MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERS AT THE EVENT DON'T LIKE IT THEN WE WILL CONSIDER REMOVING IT FOR NEXT YEAR. BUT, UNLESS I GET THE FEEDBACK FROM THE EVENT ITSELF, I HAVE NO LEGITIMATE REASON FOR CHANGING THIS IN THE TOURNAMENT.

3.) I just like to express my hope that the exam will
be handed out in several languages, because many
players will come from non-english speaking countries.

THE BLOOD BOWL, LIKE ALL THE GT'S HELD IN NOTTINGHAM AT THE MOMENT, IS A UK TOURNAMENT. BECAUSE OF THIS, THE RULES AND ALL ELEMENTS OF THE TOURNAMENT ARE WRITTEN IN ENGLISH. IF INTERNATIONAL PLAYERS WISH TO TRAVEL OVER TO THE
UK TO PLAY BLOOD BOWL, THEN THEY ARE MORE THAN WELCOME, BUT IT IS STILL A UK SHOW AND IS FORMATTED ACCORDINGLY. WE ARE NOT TRYING TO EXCLUDE ANYBODY, WE ARE PURELY PROVIDING THE MOST PRACTICAL WAY TO RUN A TOURNAMENT WITH THE TIME AND FACILITIES AT OUR DISPOSAL. IN ADDITION, IT DOESN'T SEEM TO
HAVE BEEN AN ISSUE LAST YEAR AS THE OVERALL WINNER WAS IN FACT A SPANISH PLAYER (MARCOS TARRASSO OCANA) WHO DIDN'T EXPRESS ANY COMPLAINT ABOUT THE FORMAT OR LANGUAGE RESTRICTIONS WITHIN THE UK BLOOD BOWL TOURNAMENT.

4.) Next, I hope to see a changes towards reflecting
TD and CAS in the scoring.

5.) Lastly I put my pledge in for reducing the
percentage of non-playing tournament points (such as
paining, sportsmanship, team selection, knowledge) in
the overall standings, because 40% is a little too
steep in my opinion.

Let me end on a positive note: I like the game of
Blood Bowl very much and thank Jervis and GW for
bringing it out into the public and for us to play at
a great location.

LET ME END ON A POSITIVE NOTE ALSO, I VALUE THE FEEDBACK FROM PLAYERS OF THE GREAT GAME OF BLOOD BOWL. YOUR COMMENTS WILL BE ON MY MIND WHEN I REVIEW THIS TOURNAMENT PACK AS WILL THE COMMENTS AND SUGGESTIONS OF ALL PLAYERS WHO ATTEND BLOOD BOWL 43

GOOD LUCK

BRIAN ADERSON

UK TOURNAMENT MANAGER

Best regards
Torsten

Well this is all stuff the NAF can help influence. Hopefully we can have a chat with the UK events team and talk to them about how we can help them in the future.

IN ADDITION, IT DOESN'T SEEM TO
HAVE BEEN AN ISSUE LAST YEAR AS THE OVERALL WINNER WAS IN FACT A SPANISH PLAYER (MARCOS TARRASSO OCANA) WHO DIDN'T EXPRESS ANY COMPLAINT ABOUT THE FORMAT OR LANGUAGE RESTRICTIONS WITHIN THE UK BLOOD BOWL TOURNAMENT.

He also didn't have to write a team background and have 10% of his points come from a written quiz in English.

I DON'T SEE HOW SIMILARITIES TO OTHER EVENTS IN TERMS OF FORMAT IS A LEGITIMATE REASON FOR CHANGING IT.

IN ADDITION, IT DOESN'T SEEM TO
HAVE BEEN AN ISSUE LAST YEAR AS THE OVERALL WINNER WAS IN FACT A SPANISH PLAYER (MARCOS TARRASSO OCANA) WHO DIDN'T EXPRESS ANY COMPLAINT ABOUT THE FORMAT OR LANGUAGE RESTRICTIONS WITHIN THE UK BLOOD BOWL TOURNAMENT.

If Fanatic/GW actually kept the same group organising things from year to year it might actually get better. Instead we just get random change every time.

I still expect Skaven or Welfs to win it

Thads, you should be keeping criticism a little more constructive, that last post was OTT IMO.

I love the idea of a quiz. I love the idea of teams all having fluff, because most of mine do anyway. Making it part of the scoring is pure madness though.

As long as the ruleset does not explicitly state that the background has to be written in English, i'll be a rules lawyer and write it in German.

if it is as it appears, and I'm taking Indigo at his word on that

Brain did point out the fanactic team had seen and agreed the rules.

For the biggest BB tournament in the world, and the main GW official one, it should be striving to be a beacon of tourney running rather than trying to get by using another systems rules and ideas.

BTW, I sent Brian a link to this thread earlier, there's some very valid points been made.

Maybe a stupid question, but is Brian in the NAF, as I thought only NAF members had access to the forum?

you stole my idea

... and in some cases find NAFers that are willing to run the tournament in place of people who don't care about BloodBowl.

I think they have proven they need more then advice they need to step aside and let someone who knows the game organize things.

Tim, Norse should be translated into Norwegian please.

Norwegian and Swedish are more like two dialects of the same language anywy.

I think my Norwegian cousins would argue with that. In any case Norwegian is closer to Danish than Swedish, although all three can understand each other.

Icelandic may be closer to Old Norse (I don't know), but the Norsemen of the Viking era came from Norway, and the Norwegians still call themselves Norse. To my mind this makes Norwegian more appropriate.

Anyway, I can understand why they are only offering the event materials in English. However, I think the NAF can help out people who speak other languages by organizing translations for those who don't speak English as a first language. I'm proposing we get a group of volunteers together that can help translate team background write-ups into English.

Any volunteers? I don't speak any other languages but I can help organize things if need be.