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Deathwing |
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Post subject:
 Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 01:52 AM
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Former President
Joined: Feb 10, 2003
England
Posts: 1289
Location: England
Status: Offline
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I'm not going to let this degenerate into personal arguments that are in danger of getting overheated. Bear that in mind please or this thread will be re-locked.
We're way off the Ogre rule topic anyway, anti-GW rants about their policies of WH and WH 40K sales are very old news and aren't really relevent to BB anyway.
As far as BB goes, there's always been change and/or evolution making figures redundant. Who else has 2 surplus Wights, Ogres from Dwarf/Orc teams? I've got a team of (converted) snotlings from 4th ed days, hell, even Daemon and Bretonnian teams were legal for a while, Unicorns for Amazons etc.
We have had free rules for a number of years now, and worth remembering that both High Elf and Undead teams weren't scrapped simply because the community screamed blue murder. Try and apply some perspective. |
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 Ex-UK NTO,ex- Senior Tourney Co-Ordinator, ex-VP and ex-President....because Lycos says that new members don't know who I was..
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Spazzfist |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 05:53 AM
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Joined: Aug 16, 2004
Canada
Posts: 3954
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
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GalakStarscraper wrote: ALL coaches were invited to join the discussion on multiple occassions. This has been an open forum project since May 10, 2004. So as to what considerations were given to the coaches of existing teams ... they were all openly welcome to participate in the discussions on possible changes to their teams.
Did I miss this? Was there some announcement on NAF to let us know that there was going to be this discussion going on? If so, my apologies for missing it. But if not, then you can hardly say that ALL coaches were invited as we are a large part of the BB gaming community.
Spazz |
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#1 Nurgle coach in Canada (formerly the world!)
#1 Snotling coach in Canada
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GalakStarscraper |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 07:12 AM
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Ex-Rulz Committee
Joined: Feb 11, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 1562
Status: Offline
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bareuf |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 07:19 AM
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Joined: May 05, 2005
Posts: 17
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Paul wrote: I don't know how final the vault rules are, but what about a mix of Goblin/Snotling players??
that would be a nice suggestion |
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Spazzfist |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 07:32 AM
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Joined: Aug 16, 2004
Canada
Posts: 3954
Location: Canada
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GalakStarscraper wrote: So yeah ... the posts were there Spazzfist ... I'm sorry you missed them.
Believe me, so am I! But thanks for letting me know. |
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#1 Nurgle coach in Canada (formerly the world!)
#1 Snotling coach in Canada
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GalakStarscraper |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 08:15 AM
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Ex-Rulz Committee
Joined: Feb 11, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 1562
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Deathwing wrote: As far as BB goes, there's always been change and/or evolution making figures redundant. Who else has 2 surplus Wights Yup I have those on the shelf Quote: Ogres from Dwarf/Orc teams? Yup got those on the shelf Quote: I've got a team of (converted) snotlings from 4th ed days, I do as well Quote: hell, even Daemon and Bretonnian teams were legal for a while I have all 4 Daemon teams and a converted Bretonnian team from 4th edition Quote: Unicorns for Amazons etc. Yup got the Unicorn.
Quote: Try and apply some perspective. Deathwing forgot to mention having a Slann team which I do as well.
I wanted to post this with Deathwing's list ... because I want to reinforce that I am very aware of how changes to the official rules can suck when you've purchased the minis. Every single one of the changes Deathwing lists above has been money I spent that is no longer for an official part of a team. I won't approve a change to the rule that would cost the players money to deal with unless I felt game balance was a stake. I'll leave it at that.
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 13, 2005 - 03:29 PM
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Joined: Feb 10, 2003
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Posts: 2696
Location: Undisclosed
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Or you can do what I'm doing, which is to ignore the "official" Ogre team, and play a (imo) much more interesting one.
Code: 0-12 Ogre Blocker 5 5 1 9 Mighty Blow, Really Stupid, TSkull, Big Guy 100k S
0-4 Ogre Blitzer 5 5 2 9 Bonehead, Mighty Blow, TSkull, TTM 120k S
0-4 Goblin Catcher 6 2 3 7 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff 40k A
70k Rerolls
That's the one which will be in our league rulebook (though I might go 6/2/3/6 for the Gobs, and call 'em Knoblars, as I like those figs), and the one which will be in our tourney (if I ever gor it off the ground).
I do agree with ABigwood though - wheter of not it had anything to do with GW, to those that "aren't in the know" it will just look like another case of GW screwing over it's customers. |
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Khaine |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 14, 2005 - 08:20 AM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2003
Posts: 193
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Darkson wrote: Or you can do what I'm doing, which is to ignore the "official" Ogre team, and play a (imo) much more interesting one.
Code: 0-12 Ogre Blocker 5 5 1 9 Mighty Blow, Really Stupid, TSkull, Big Guy 100k S
0-4 Ogre Blitzer 5 5 2 9 Bonehead, Mighty Blow, TSkull, TTM 120k S
0-4 Goblin Catcher 6 2 3 7 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff 40k A
70k Rerolls
That's the one which will be in our league rulebook (though I might go 6/2/3/6 for the Gobs, and call 'em Knoblars, as I like those figs), and the one which will be in our tourney (if I ever gor it off the ground).
I do agree with ABigwood though - wheter of not it had anything to do with GW, to those that "aren't in the know" it will just look like another case of GW screwing over it's customers.
That's not a bad team.. The RS makes the lone ogres really unreliable, and the ogre blitzers are the only one chucking gobbies. Plus I'm assuming that since your line ogres are "Big Guys" they can't use rerolls.. I actually like the idea of this team. It seems more like an ogre team and not a snotling team.. |
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Touch my Mini's and Pull Back A Stump!!!!!
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biggy |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 14, 2005 - 07:32 PM
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Joined: Feb 13, 2003
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This is similar team that I suggested (this one's better). But the die has been cast I'm afraid. We'll get what we're given and like it!
Andrew |
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"Crush your enemies. See them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women!"
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 17, 2005 - 09:41 AM
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Joined: Feb 10, 2003
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ABigwood wrote: This is similar team that I suggested (this one's better). But the die has been cast I'm afraid. We'll get what we're given and like it!
Like I said, if you don't like it, house-rule it out and put something you do like in it's place. It's not like GW are going to send the Rule-Enforcement squad round to check up on you.  |
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_____ and rankings - that is all
#27 of the "24 club" (due to some dodgy accounting)
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 17, 2005 - 09:46 AM
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Joined: Feb 10, 2003
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Posts: 2696
Location: Undisclosed
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Khaine wrote: That's not a bad team.. The RS makes the lone ogres really unreliable, and the ogre blitzers are the only one chucking gobbies. Plus I'm assuming that since your line ogres are "Big Guys" they can't use rerolls.. I actually like the idea of this team. It seems more like an ogre team and not a snotling team..
Just to point out, I can't take any credit for that team, it was the one that TBB devised whe the Ogre figs were announced.
But yeah, the Ogre Blockers are BG's, so can't use RR's. The "fluff" behind it was that the clever Ogres mainly got out of their own teams, and went to play for others for more money (or whatever).
With only 4 players that can assist the RS guys (the Goblins/Knoblars), it makes having a full squad of Ogres less palatable, though you could risk it if you wanted to.
One of the reasons that it never stood a chance was that JJ reckoned it would be to difficult to tell the RS Ogres from the BH ones. Well, that "might" have been an issue (though total bollox if you ask me), but with those very nice Ogre Kingdom plastics out now, it would be a perfect time to bring it back. Of course, the fact that OK plastics would go on the balance sheet for WFB and not for Fanatic makes it a complete non-starter;). |
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_____ and rankings - that is all
#27 of the "24 club" (due to some dodgy accounting)
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Spazzfist |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 17, 2005 - 01:48 PM
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Joined: Aug 16, 2004
Canada
Posts: 3954
Location: Canada
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Okay....
I have had a chance to read over the vault rules, and I have to ademit that overall I do like a lot of what I am seeing in there. Skills like jump up being split into two skills and cool new skills like "Wrestle" make for a more interesting game. Also the fact that the Nurgle team is becoming a more viable for league play is very welcome.
However, I still have to say that I am unhappy about the ogres. I feel that there are better things that could be done with them. As Darkson suggested, having a distinction between ogre types would be one route. You could make the team more balanced in league play without cutting them off at the knees. |
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#1 Snotling coach in Canada
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biggy |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 17, 2005 - 07:13 PM
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Joined: Feb 13, 2003
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Like I said, if you don't like it, house-rule it out and put something you do like in it's place. It's not like GW are going to send the Rule-Enforcement squad round to check up on you. [/quote]
Yeah that's true at home. But at tournament level you're stuck with the piss-poor 'official' list. I just don't get why the team had to be utterly crippled to make it 'balanced'. But what do I know I only buy the product and play the game. I'm not the one that should be happy with rules now am I?
Andrew |
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"Crush your enemies. See them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women!"
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Khaine |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 18, 2005 - 08:55 AM
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Joined: Sep 06, 2003
Posts: 193
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Quote:
One of the reasons that it never stood a chance was that JJ reckoned it would be to difficult to tell the RS Ogres from the BH ones. Well, that "might" have been an issue (though total bollox if you ask me), but with those very nice Ogre Kingdom plastics out now, it would be a perfect time to bring it back. Of course, the fact that OK plastics would go on the balance sheet for WFB and not for Fanatic makes it a complete non-starter;).
Oh man that's just BS. Something as simple as bases with a specific rock, or colored ring around the outside would solve any problem with remembering RS. I can see where there Might be a concern, but it just seems unfounded since it could be taken care of quite easily. Well thanks for the view of what ogres could have been, I guess since I have yet to be to a tourney, I won't cry too much. |
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Touch my Mini's and Pull Back A Stump!!!!!
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 18, 2005 - 10:46 AM
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Joined: Feb 10, 2003
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Posts: 2696
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ABigwood wrote: Yeah that's true at home. But at tournament level you're stuck with the piss-poor 'official' list. I just don't get why the team had to be utterly crippled to make it 'balanced'. But what do I know I only buy the product and play the game. I'm not the one that should be happy with rules now am I?
I guess wheter a "varient" Ogre list would be acceptable at a tourney is a) up to the TO, and b) up to the NAF officials (for ranking purposes). |
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_____ and rankings - that is all
#27 of the "24 club" (due to some dodgy accounting)
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