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Jonny_P |
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Post subject:
 Posted: Jan 10, 2012 - 08:37 PM
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Joined: Feb 10, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 899
Location: United States of America
Status: Offline
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I think 100 is a realistic goal for a NATC.
Zlurpee a couple years ago had 68, and actually Chaos Cup and Spike last year both had 56. I'm hoping to exceed 68 at Chaos Cup this year. |
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generaljason |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 10:48 AM
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Joined: Dec 04, 2009
British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 439
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Status: Offline
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Notorious_jtb wrote:
I belive Zlurpee has the US record at 68 and the Spike in Canada got 51.
Sorry I've been absent from this discussion but holidays and Thunderbowl play-offs coming up next Saturday have been sucking up most of my time as of late.
Spike! Magazine had 56 coaches last year - we should have had over 60. 4 of our core Spike! attendees from TB had either family, emergency work and what not, and 3 RCR players jammed out last minute.
Notorious_jtb wrote:
Without it being the primary aim, I am sure a successful North American Team Championship would only help a bid for the World Cup but that process would be very complicated and it would be far from certain to leave the European continent.
No disrespect intended Joe but I said before and I'll say it again - first WC had 274 coaches, last one had 480. WC should always stay in Europe - no North American city is ever going to come close to that short of Simon (amongst hundreds of other Europeans) winning the lottery.  Not a hope in hell.
Who wants to put in a bid to host the first (and definitely the last) WC on North American soil when that bid will never even come close to getting half of the attendees of even the first WC? May sound like pessimism guys but I'm just trying to be realistic in that even with a headcount of 480 no North American team was turned away - we benefited from 'affirmative action', whereas at least half a dozen Euro teams were not able to attend. Probably about 90% of all tournament players worldwide hang their hat in Europe which is why it should remain there for at least our lifetime until those demographics change.
As for the NATC - the North American answer to never hosting a WC. 102 coaches (26 teams of 4) or more would be a fantastic (and I think realistic) turnout for such an event, but would be an abject failure for WC given the precedent already established in 2007, and then smashed in 2011. I think it's time some people resign themselves to that fact and stop thinking of an inaugural NATC as being some sort of stepping stone to host a future WC - again I'm sorry to say it but that's a pipe dream.
Even if you had no Europeans and just North Americans - if you add the West (56 coaches at Spike!) and the East (56 coaches at Chaos Cup) we barely break 100 by ourselves at that's only if everyone who at least attended the NA Majors unanimously attended - Europe can surpass 400 all by itself without breaking a sweat.
Notorious_jtb wrote:
To all the people with offers of help and kind words, once we do determine the location of the event, the local team will need an incredible amount of support so your contributions will be very welcome!
Again I applaud you Joe for taking the time to front this conversation for the rest of us and trying to get this up and running!  I did actually read every post in this thread before writing and wow - you've taken a lot of inflammatory and completely unproductive flack for doing so in the beginning. I'm sorry I wasn't here earlier to defend you with duck tape and a hammer (I'm kidding I would have used a bazooka!)
Keep up the great work and looking forward to seeing some genuine bids for the inaugural North American Team Challenge in the next few weeks! I promise not to be a stranger.
Craig. |
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Daggers |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 11:34 AM
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Joined: Dec 07, 2006
Canada
Posts: 1618
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
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generaljason wrote: Notorious_jtb wrote:
Without it being the primary aim, I am sure a successful North American Team Championship would only help a bid for the World Cup but that process would be very complicated and it would be far from certain to leave the European continent.
No disrespect intended Joe but I said before and I'll say it again - first WC had 274 coaches, last one had 480. WC should always stay in Europe - no North American city is ever going to come close to that …
I am totally with this, as much as I want to go to a WC, I don’t think it makes sense to have a WC in NA. The numbers just aren’t there. Why would we want a WC here with 100 coaches when ANYWHERE in Europe could have 5x that easy. It just doesn’t make sense. Yes, it’s an international community, but you want a HUGE event like this where you can have the most attendees, and NA is just not it. I have said this numerous times, and will say it again, lets concentrate on making a NA event a kick-ass event and enjoy it as a unification of NA coaches. |
_________________
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Glamdryn |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 11:36 AM
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Joined: Sep 16, 2009
United States of America
Posts: 203
Location: United States of America
Status: Offline
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Negative nancy...
I think it would be fantastic to have WCIII in the states or Australia. World Cup? Not European Cup... |
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Lizardcore |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 11:48 AM
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Joined: Apr 07, 2004
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| It's funny because a lot of Europeans (bunch of communists anyway ) are quite sensitive to the fact that the NAF is international, therefore the WC should be held outside Europe regularly (lets say 1/3), even if there is only 200 coaches participating. |
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Notorious_jtb |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 11:50 AM
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Joined: Sep 02, 2005
Canada
Posts: 1456
Location: Canada
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Good stuff.
The numbers for SPIKE and other events were from Doubleskulls website and may be just the NAF registered players only at the time of his data download so sorry for the error.
I agree 26 teams and 102 players is a great target!
RE WC III, I think realism is needed but "dreaming" is ok. Do I think we can get a 500 player tournament in NA by 2015, probably not very likely. Do I think we will get any votes to host a WC without getting a 100 player tournament ever in North America, no chance.
The reason for doing the North American Championship is because it is an awesome idea and could be a fantastic thing for us and NAF in NA. If as a by product of having a great event it raises the chance of a NA WC by 1% that is nice too. But given how sad people were about teams not being able to enter the last event I would say telling people ok, entry is $2000 minimum would make a lot of people in Europe really sad. Really, getting respect and attention from the rest of the World to the NA scene is the real byproduct, not a WC bid. If we get 3-5 teams come from other continents to the NA Championship that would be awesome!!! |
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Notorious_jtb |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 11:53 AM
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Joined: Sep 02, 2005
Canada
Posts: 1456
Location: Canada
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Lizardcore wrote: It's funny because a lot of Europeans (bunch of communists anyway ) are quite sensitive to the fact that the NAF is international, therefore the WC should be held outside Europe regularly (lets say 1/3), even if there is only 200 coaches participating.
OO cross post. Yeah I didn't want to focus on that aspect of the politics but yeah, FIFA influences a lot these days 
As I say, even with that we need to prove 100 NA coaches will gather together.
So if we make the North American Championship a success, we gain that 1%........
But if we get the NA championship rolling and it is two years removed from the WC then regardless of continent both might benefit from a "global community with closer ties". |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 12:05 PM
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Joined: May 09, 2008
Canada
Posts: 207
Location: Canada
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I'd like to see how things go down with the NAC first and foremost, maybe WC IV might find a home in NA but as it stands I think WCIII should certainly remain in Europe. Plenty of countries left in Europe to keep it 'worldy' too 
I think I saw some data that stated there there are some 2000 NAF players who competed in a tournament in 2011. That is not a helluva lot of clout for the time being. |
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daloonieshaman |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 12:17 PM
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Joined: Feb 28, 2003
United States of America
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Location: United States of America
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1) There is no reason a WC cannot be held outside of Europe.
This is about the NATC.
We are gonna have zero people show up. until we find a location and start taking reg. money.
The Key to the NATC attendance is advertising. I am talking anywhere and everywhere. All the podcast, all the forums, black box forums. Every single Tournament. Emails from every League Commish to his broad player group. Think big American corporation. They shove their branding down our throats. Do we get annoyed, yes, are we fed up, yes, do we go out and buy their product if we have some interest, hell yes! Also the best form of advertising Word of Mouth and information. You say "Dave lets go to the NATC. What the hell is the NATC? I don't know." you think he will be inticed no
now if you said Dave Let play a game. During the game you say "I am thinking about going to the NATC, you going? What is the NATC? Well it is ...."
Now Dave is thinking about going.
a) you are considering it/going
b) you gave him informed information and planted that seed'
the rest is logistics |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 12:31 PM
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Joined: Feb 10, 2003
Undisclosed
Posts: 2696
Location: Undisclosed
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Lizardcore wrote: It's funny because a lot of Europeans (bunch of communists anyway ) are quite sensitive to the fact that the NAF is international, therefore the WC should be held outside Europe regularly (lets say 1/3), even if there is only 200 coaches participating.
+1 from me, even if I couldn't get there - why should we Brits (and the odd Euro ) get all the fun?
(I'm British, dammit, not European - I'll start calling you American next!  ) |
_________________
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daloonieshaman |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 12:37 PM
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Joined: Feb 28, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 883
Location: United States of America
Status: Offline
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Darkson wrote: Lizardcore wrote: It's funny because a lot of Europeans (bunch of communists anyway ) are quite sensitive to the fact that the NAF is international, therefore the WC should be held outside Europe regularly (lets say 1/3), even if there is only 200 coaches participating.
+1 from me, even if I couldn't get there - why should we Brits (and the odd Euro ) get all the fun?
(I'm British, dammit, not European - I'll start calling you American next! )
Arrogant freakin Brits. don't even know geography  |
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Lizardcore |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 12:57 PM
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Joined: Apr 07, 2004
Posts: 513
Status: Offline
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daloonieshaman wrote: Arrogant freakin Brits. don't even know geography
Daloonie, you made my day |
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Notorious_jtb |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 01:41 PM
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Joined: Sep 02, 2005
Canada
Posts: 1456
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
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Darkson wrote: Lizardcore wrote: It's funny because a lot of Europeans (bunch of communists anyway ) are quite sensitive to the fact that the NAF is international, therefore the WC should be held outside Europe regularly (lets say 1/3), even if there is only 200 coaches participating.
+1 from me, even if I couldn't get there - why should we Brits (and the odd Euro ) get all the fun?
(I'm British, dammit, not European - I'll start calling you American next! )
Haha, 'son, Lizardcore may be a little more European than you suspect 
But still calling a Frenchman American...
Quote:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 12:57 PM
daloonieshaman wrote:
Arrogant freakin Brits. don't even know geography
Daloonie, you made my day
That's why this is funny |
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zootsuitjeff |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2012 - 03:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 29, 2010
United States of America
Posts: 125
Location: United States of America
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| I think the WCIII and whether it should be out of Europe has been discussed extensively in its own thread. Very briefly, my opinion is that there are other factors besides just sheer # of attendees that should determine where the WC is held. Yes a NA WC would be smaller than 480, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. And I do think NATC is a stepping stone in the sense of proving that we can successfully hold a large international event, but it definitely is also a goal in itself. Anyways I think we should focus primarily on the NATC at this point. |
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Notorious_jtb |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 12, 2012 - 07:40 AM
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Joined: Sep 02, 2005
Canada
Posts: 1456
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
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zootsuitjeff wrote: I think the WCIII and whether it should be out of Europe has been discussed extensively in its own thread. Very briefly, my opinion is that there are other factors besides just sheer # of attendees that should determine where the WC is held. Yes a NA WC would be smaller than 480, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. And I do think NATC is a stepping stone in the sense of proving that we can successfully hold a large international event, but it definitely is also a goal in itself. Anyways I think we should focus primarily on the NATC at this point.
Absolutely agree with that Jeff!
We can open a North American WC thread after we have this process completed here. The people who are eager to discuss the WC can rest assured that this work/discussion here is only helping them get what they want.
Back the NATC!!!! |
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