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Tojurub |
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Post subject: Other dwarf tactics than Da Cage??
 Posted: Dec 07, 2003 - 09:05 PM
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Joined: Aug 18, 2003
Germany
Posts: 1520
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
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Hi all,
I'm playing dwarves for a while now and was wondering if any other coach actually plays them differently....meaning: not using the cage tactic?
To give it a start:
I found it very interersting (and often even effective) to play a dwarf passing game with Blitzers and Runners in the lead. I'm trying to give my runners Accurate and then Pass and my Blitzers if somehow possible Catch. That way with one Runner and a Blitzer on the centerline in the widezones I can score in two turns....if all the GFIs (at least one is needed) work and (get this  ) you make all the dodges  you drive your opponents nuts  . I don't way I win every game with it, but it's fun when it works. 
Just curious if somebody else plays the dwarves out of the ordinary  |
_________________
Dwarves rule!!! Especially when they pass!
3rd place Underworld Cup 2003
Swiss Champion 2004
2nd place Royal RumBBL 2015 and White Star Cup 2016
.....and now Ex-Vize-Prez
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 07, 2003 - 09:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 24, 2003
Posts: 1671
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I'm primarily an elf coach, though i've played almost all the teams in the game at one point or another. Had success with all of them, except one. I tried playing dwarves once, tried to play them like elves. I failed miserably.
If you want my advice, forget the passing game with dwarves, except as a last resort. |
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They will slowly add bits of the vault in on each RR leading up to 2007, starting with LRB 4.0, so it will be a slow and agonising death for BB.
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Doubleskulls |
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 08, 2003 - 02:50 AM
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Ex-Rulz Committee
Joined: Mar 05, 2003
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Location: Kent, UK
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| Well you can have variations of the cage. The wedge is quite popular. In general trying to make a team do something it isn't build for doesn't work. You end up being weaker at your strengths and not good enough at the other aspect(s) of the game. |
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Ian 'Double Skulls' Williams
SLOBB
NAF Racial Results
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Tojurub |
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 08, 2003 - 07:26 AM
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Joined: Aug 18, 2003
Germany
Posts: 1520
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
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Zombie wrote:
If you want my advice, forget the passing game with dwarves, except as a last resort.
Thank you for your advice, but Igraciously decline 
Over the last...say 4-6 years (with some breaks in between) I played with an almost 50% winning percentage (30% draw, 20%-losing). Therefore I think I'm quite successfull with it. I have to admit whenever my dice starts to keep failing (damn 1s) I kind of go back and try the cage, but usually it's too late then (and since all dice are starting to fail at the same time I roll a lot of  AND 1s)
Doubleskulls wrote:
In general trying to make a team do something it isn't build for doesn't work.
I don't see why a dwarf team is not build for passing. Just look at the stats of the Runner and the Blitzer and compare it with the Human team. Yes, the Humans have three players (Catcher, Thrower and Blitzer) compared to the two dwarf positions and are only a tad bit faster, but the ST & AG are the basically the same and the AV is much higher for the dwarfs. And with the Tackle skill of the Longbeards you can keep the opponents from Dodging away from them trying to get to the "important" players.
I usually don't start out as a passing team (that would be suicide). I wait until my runners get at least Accurate and either a Blitzer or a Runner gets Catch or +1AG ...or I can afford to by more re-rolls.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the dwarfs are a passing team from the start like the elf teams, but with 5-6 players advancing in skills you can get there. I'm just saying the dwarves can be played differently then just settling for 2 TD in a game and have some fun with it. (Just keep them away from the beer for a day before the game ) |
_________________
Dwarves rule!!! Especially when they pass!
3rd place Underworld Cup 2003
Swiss Champion 2004
2nd place Royal RumBBL 2015 and White Star Cup 2016
.....and now Ex-Vize-Prez
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Iceman |
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 08, 2003 - 10:44 AM
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Joined: Jul 10, 2003
Posts: 19
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| It depends if your playing a NAF tournament where everybody uses TR100 teams do if you play a league/Cup whre you can advance towards a passing game. Ive tried every once in while to pass with my dwarves and generally have gotten 1's so it does not matter whose throwing. It is fun take the ruler and say "I'll go for a long bomb"........ |
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Tojurub |
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 08, 2003 - 11:36 AM
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Joined: Aug 18, 2003
Germany
Posts: 1520
Location: Germany
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Iceman wrote: It depends if your playing a NAF tournament where everybody uses TR100 teams do if you play a league/Cup whre you can advance towards a passing game. Ive tried every once in while to pass with my dwarves and generally have gotten 1's so it does not matter whose throwing. It is fun take the ruler and say "I'll go for a long bomb"........
It's also very funny to look into the face of your opponent when you do that the first time....first they burst out laughing, then they ask you if you are serious...when you tell them yes they got this weird look not not knowing if they should be scared or should be feeling sorry for me.... After you catch that damn thing on a 3+ they are in shock
Even elves fumble on a 1 
Actually, even in tournaments it's possible...ask OldManMonkey how many Long Bombs and Long Passes I made against him in the Underworld Cup??? I think he's still cursing his hobgoblin for tripping over his feet 3 squares away from the end zone |
_________________
Dwarves rule!!! Especially when they pass!
3rd place Underworld Cup 2003
Swiss Champion 2004
2nd place Royal RumBBL 2015 and White Star Cup 2016
.....and now Ex-Vize-Prez
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Old_Man_Monkey |
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 08, 2003 - 11:47 AM
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Joined: Apr 16, 2003
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Oh great, thanks for the holiday cheer memories, Tors!!!
Since your passes (yes, PASSES!) were completed on 5s and 6s, I'm not sure what was proven except that I was caught out of position and failed with my Mino at the crucial moment . . . kind of like Iceman's woes in reverse...
Full marks to you for pulling it off though - I'm sure the expression on my face was worthy of laughter!!!
On the whole, I'd agree with DSkulls - development of that kind does not play into the team's natural strengths. And like I've said elsewhere, that Hobgolin is no longer among the living . . . curse his soul!
-OMM |
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Tournament Organizer - The Three Kingdoms Challenge
Semi-retired NAF staff
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Tojurub |
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Post subject:
Posted: Dec 08, 2003 - 12:44 PM
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Joined: Aug 18, 2003
Germany
Posts: 1520
Location: Germany
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Sorry OMM for sticking that finger in the open wound 
In you particular case I actually didn't look at your face, but on the dice in disbelieve of just having pulled that one of (plus making these insane dodge rolls). The last two matches on Saturday I was blessed with high dice rolls!
You said it yourself a 5 and a 6 were needed to pull that one off, but that's actually a rare case of throwing long passes or bombs...I try to stick with the quick and short passes.
On the other hand...I'm not really playing against the natural strength of my team...I'm still giving Mighty Blows and Guard to my Longbeards und using my Slayers to thin out the opposing line...especially if there are opponents left carelesly close to the side line |
_________________
Dwarves rule!!! Especially when they pass!
3rd place Underworld Cup 2003
Swiss Champion 2004
2nd place Royal RumBBL 2015 and White Star Cup 2016
.....and now Ex-Vize-Prez
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SteelThunder |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 04, 2004 - 10:44 PM
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Joined: Dec 25, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 83
Location: United States of America
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Hey there all!
I'm fairly new at blood bowl, but I have tried some other tactics than "Da Cage", because I find it such a boring approach to such a fun game.
I've tried variations of wedge-type plays. I like to use a troll slayer assisted by a longbeard with guard, who can get up front and help the slayer open up a gap in the middle. I like to pound the ball down the middle, using Slayers and Blitzers knocking the opponent around. Use your longbeards to seal up and hold off the opposition. With a 9 AV, they can take a beating and slow down the opponents, who tend to get a little nervous putting their blitzers in the path of the onslaught, er I mean advance.
For a back up option, I'll keep a runner or a blitzers (both preferrably), running along side just to keep a pass option open in case the opponent gets lucky and cuts into my line. The dwarves 3 agility on 4 players is modest, but with a reroll handy, can be a funny surprise.
Don't forget..you can throw the ball to ANY square on the field. I recently tried a fun move, sending a couple dwarfs (including a blitzer) down field, blocking a receiver, then going deep. Once I got the ball from my opponent, I threw it deep, expecting it to miss. The opponent was too far away and I just scooped up the ball next turn and scored.
Other tactics are useful if your league allows you to use a Big Guy, or in the dwarf's case: an Ogre (Your only choice). Sometimes the oppoents get so intimidated by the Ogre that it opens up the sidelines for some quick passes. I'm thinking that Dump-Off may be a bit more usefull down the road. I inititally tried the accurate/pass combo, but those "1's" tend to creep up on stubby dwarf hands.
Other tactics I like to try is the "choo-choo" (Remeber the old NFL commercial with the crazy ref?). This is when your opponent has a player on the second squares from the sideline. If you can get a player, longbeard, blitzer, whoever, in a position where they can assist on a block on the victim, er target opponent so that you can bring a troll slayer straight in...then choose the pushback each time, you get to roll two dice to block (your choice), and send the unsuspecting fool into the stands. I found this very effective, and as you take opponents off the field, you can play more and try other "unorthodox" tactics with your dwarfs. This tactic is also good on big guys, as the Troll Slayers with their Dauntless and an assist can send Rat Ogres and Minotaurs off the field and get an injury on those tough targets. Boy was that fun against the Skaven team's Rat Ogre!
One more thing with the dwarfs....with a 3 agility, don't be afraid to dodge, but as for the linemen....don't chance it unless you're packing a lot of rerolls and can afford to use them up.
Good luck, I'd love to hear more since I'm still new at this too!
Mike B |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 05, 2004 - 01:08 PM
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Joined: Oct 24, 2003
Posts: 1671
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The sending into the crowd thing is not unorthodox for dwarves, it's the basic play! But it's not a way to score.
Everything else you mentioned sounds exactly like the cage to me. |
_________________
They will slowly add bits of the vault in on each RR leading up to 2007, starting with LRB 4.0, so it will be a slow and agonising death for BB.
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SteelThunder |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 10, 2004 - 12:00 PM
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Joined: Dec 25, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 83
Location: United States of America
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Well, for what it's worth, I've never had an official "Cage" training, and just tried things that I felt would work. I'm still new to the game, and we are getting in more exhibition games in till we launch a new league in February.
I'll gladly try some other tricks to see what happens. I'm curious on doing a triple play with a runner running, doing a quickpass to a blitzer/runner and then having them hand-off to a lineman. Even with a 2 agility, it should only be a 4+ with a reroll. That and some "go-for-its" and who knows, maybe I can surprise someone. |
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longfang |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2004 - 05:12 AM
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Joined: Feb 12, 2003
Posts: 189
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| Dwarf teams work best as a (very dull) compact unit. Sending your runner 14 squares away from the guy with the ball just so you can try to move the ball 20 squares will leave him very vunerable to a good kicking. Your runners are targets, lose them and your stuffed. |
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TuernRedvenom |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 11, 2004 - 02:15 PM
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Joined: Dec 28, 2003
Posts: 142
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SteelThunder wrote: Even with a 2 agility, it should only be a 4+ with a reroll.
lol, you really are new to this game. The key thing to remember is that turnovers are very, very bad for you. You shouldn't take risks like that unless the scoreline is looking bad or maybe if you've got yourself covered if something does go wrong. Remember you can only use one re-roll per turn. |
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Tutenkharnage |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jan 12, 2004 - 06:21 AM
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Joined: Feb 11, 2003
Posts: 620
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SteelThunder wrote: I'll gladly try some other tricks to see what happens. I'm curious on doing a triple play with a runner running, doing a quickpass to a blitzer/runner and then having them hand-off to a lineman. Even with a 2 agility, it should only be a 4+ with a reroll. That and some "go-for-its" and who knows, maybe I can surprise someone.
That's all well and good, but what are the odds that you'll have a Longbeard so far down the field?
-Chet |
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