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GalakStarscraperOffline
Post subject: Chaos Cup 2004, November 6, 2004 -- Chicago, IL  PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 11:35 AM
Ex-Rulz Committee


Joined: Feb 11, 2003
United States of America
Posts: 1562

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Here are the rules for this year's Chaos Cup (I just was sent the final PDF for the rules so wanted to share them ASAP with the forum):

      Quote:

Chaos Cup 2004 rules

TAKE ROOT
A new version of Take Root will be used instead of the version in the LRB 3.0:
Before taking any action roll a D6. On a 2+, the player may take his action as normal.
On a 1, the Player "takes root", and his MA is considered 0 until a touchdown is scored
or the half ends, or he is knocked over (and no, players from his own team may not try
and Block him in order to try to knock him over!). A player that has taken root may not
Go For It, be pushed back for any reason, or use any skill/trait that would allow him to
move out of his current square. The player may block adjacent players without follow-up.

PRO
Pro will be a General skill

MUMMIES
Mummies on the Undead team will cost 110k NOT 100k. IE this makes Mummies on BOTH the
Khemri and Undead teams have the same price of 110k.

EXPERIMENTAL TEAMS ALLOWED
The Chaos Cup will be allowing the current experimental Vampire and Ogre teams to play.
The vampire team will not be allowed to have the Head Coach play (only purchase Count Luthor).
So that all 18 official teams and the 2 experimental allowed for 20 total.

Rules for Ogre team:
0-12 Ogre 120,000 5 5 2 9 Mighty Blow Thick Skull, Throw Team-Mate, Bonehead --- Strength
0-6 Goblin 40,000 6 2 3 7 Dodge Right Stuff, Stunty --- Agility
Rerolls 70,000

Rules for Vampire team:
0-12 Thrall 40,000 6 3 3 7 --- General
0-6 Vampire 110,000 6 4 4 8 Hypnotic Gaze, Regenerate, Bloodthirst --- General, Agility, Strength
Rerolls 70,000 Apothecary can only be used on Thralls if purchased

New Racial Characteristic and Rules: Bloodthirst: Vampires must occasionally feed on the blood
of the living. Because of this, roll a D6 whenever a Vampire takes an action. On a 2+ the Vampire
may carry out the action as normal. On a '1', however, the Vampire is overcome by the desire to
drink Human blood; the Vampire loses their declared action for the turn and must instead take a
Move action. If the Vampire finishes the move standing adjacent to one or more Thralls, he attacks
one of them. Immediately roll for injury on the Thrall who has been attacked without making an Armor
roll. The injury will not cause a turnover unless the Thrall was holding the ball. If the Vampire is
not able to attack a Thrall (for any reason), then he is removed from the field and placed in his
team's Reserves box before his action is considered ended, and his team suffers a Turnover. If he
was holding the ball it bounces from the square he occupied when he was removed. If the Vampire is
Knocked Out or Injured before biting a Thrall, then he should be placed in the appropriate box of
the Dug Out instead of being placed in the Reserves box. Note that the Vampire is allowed to pick
up the football or do anything else they could normally do while taking a Move action, but must
bite a Thrall to avoid the Turnover.

NO GENERAL SKILL ACCESS
All players with starting Strength of 5 or more and Chaos Dwarf Bull Centaurs will be treated as
having Strength only skill access (instead of their normal General/Strength access).

GAINING SKILLS/RESETTING ROSTERS
The tournament will be 4 rounds of Swiss. Starting team will be 1,000,000. You will be allowed
your choice of giving 2 players each a normal skill or one player a doubles roll skill or mutation
after rounds 1 and 3. After round 2, you will be allowed to give one player a normal skill. A player
may not be given more than one new skill/trait during the entire tournament. All casualties that
have been inflicted on your team, including death, are wiped away at the end of the game. In other
words the team resets to your starting roster after every game. Skills accrued through the tournament
will not be lost, even if the player dies. Note: Apothecaries are still useful for bringing back
injured players during the game.

DICE
Before each game you and your opponent both agree to use ONLY ONE set of dice for the entire game ...
the other player puts his dice away where they cannot be used. If you cannot agree on the dice to be
used, a referee will decide by rolling for it. If you are superstitious about people touching your
lucky dice ... the tournament would like to suggest that you bring a different set of dice to the
tournament that you don't care if other people touch as this rule will be enforced.

WIZARDS
150k for a Wizard or a Dwarven Runesmith. Halflings get the Master Chef for free and can purchase
additional Chef rolls for 60k each as a permanent increase to the Chef's abilities. Undead and
Necromantic teams get their Necromancer for free, but may not purchase a normal wizard. Khemri
and Vampire teams may not have a wizard. To use the Necromantic/Undead Raise Dead spell during
a match, you must have an extra painted Zombie figure to represent this player during the game.

ILLEGAL PROCEDURE
The Chaos Cup will NOT be using the Illegal Procedure rule. If BOTH coaches agree to play with
the rule, they may use it. But if one or both do not wish to use the rule, then it will not be
used for the match.

MINIATURES/MUTATIONS
You team must contain only Games Workshop (GW) miniatures either Blood Bowl or converted from
another GW, Marauder, or Citadel range. All miniatures must be painted with a minimum of 2 colors
and the bases must be decorated or painted (at least green) or you will not be allowed to play.
Also mutations if you plan on having them on your team ... you MUST have a figure that clearly
shows the mutation to take it. You cannot give Claw to a Skaven Storm Vermin if you don't have a
football geared Skaven from some GW game system with a Claw for a hand.

SCORING

GAMES:
Win = 55 points
Tie = 35 points
Loss = 10 points

Blow out bonus (won by 2+ points) = +10 points
Keeping it close bonus (lost by 1 point) = +10 points
Smackdown bonus (Caused more casualties) = +10 points
Give and take (tied for casualties) = +5 points

PAINTING

+3 Based: All the bases in the team (including coaching staff) are painted and textured
in some manner. The baseline for texture is flock as a minimum. Just being painted green is not enough!

+3 Painted: The team is painted, all models have at least 3 colors on them. Different colors should be
used for different areas. Undercoats must not be visible.

+3 Detailed: All models have had the details of the model painted in a variety of colors or with
noticeable effects. This can be shading or highlighting, or 'black-lining' etc. This discriminates
between the merely painted team and the team that has had attention paid to it.

+6 Representative: All models on the team are representative of the race and position that they
are meant to portray. Extra weapons that are not part of a finished and painted figure should be
removed. This does not mean that you must use official Blood Bowl miniatures. Only that an Ogre
should look like an Ogre, a Dwarf should look like a Dwarf and so on.

Important: For all 4 of the above ... In order to get the full points for a category all the models
in the team must fulfill the criteria. If even one fails, the points can't be scored. The team
voted best overall painted team by the coaches playing in the tournament over lunch will receive an
extra 5 Painting points. The head referee and his assistants will choose the teams eligible for this
voting during the morning. You must have painted your own team to be eligible for the best painted
voting (however, teams painted by another person can still earn the full 15 normal painting points).

SPORTSMANSHIP
At the end of the tournament, coaches will rank players from most to least sporting with a 1 being
most sporting and a 4 being least ... points for each of these 4 votes will score points as follows:

1st 13 points
2nd 10 points
3rd 6 points
4th 3 points

If you have an opponent who drops out without voting you will receive 8 points from that coach.

STAR PLAYERS

If two of the same stars show up for a game, neither star will play. Note STARs do not have positions
at all, so a Human team can have 4 Blitzers and Griff, or a Halfling team could have 2 Treemen and Deeproot.
The Star Players have new costs and team assignments for that must be used for the Chaos Cup:
-- Bomber Dribblesnot ??? Orc or Goblin ??? 80,000
-- Count Luthor von Drakenborg ... Human, Necromantic, Undead, or Vampire ... 350,000
-- Deathroller ??? Dwarf ??? 160,000
-- Deeproot Strongbranch ... Halfling or Wood Elf ... 250,000
-- Fungus the Loon ??? Orc or Goblin ??? 60,000
-- Grashnak Blackhoof ... Chaos, Chaos Dwarf, or Norse ... 320,000
-- Griff Oberwald ... Human ... 360,000
-- Grim Ironjaw ... Dwarf ... 220,000
-- Hakflem Skuttlespike ... Skaven ... 230,000
-- Headsplitter ... Skaven ... 350,000
-- Horkon Heartripper ??? Dark Elf ??? 120,000
-- Hthark the Unstoppable ... Chaos Dwarf ... 340,000
-- Jordell Freshbreeze ... Elf or Wood Elf ... 230,000
-- Lord Borak the Despoiler ... Chaos ... 250,000
-- Mighty Zug ... Human ... 180,000
-- Morg `N??? Thorg ... ANY team except Goblin and Halfling may take Morg `N??? Thorg ... 420,000
-- Nobbla Blackwort ??? Orc, Goblin, or Chaos ??? 80,000
-- Prince Moranion ... Elf or High Elf ... 190,000
-- Ramtut III ... Khemri, Necromantic, or Undead ... 360,000
-- `Ripper??? Bolgrot ... Orc, Goblin, or Chaos ... 200,000
-- Scrappa Sorehead ??? Orc, Goblin, or Chaos ??? 60,000
-- Silibili ... Lizardman ... 240,000
-- Thrud the Barbarian ... Any team may take Thrud ... 200,000
-- Varag Ghoul-Chewer ... Orc ... 250,000
-- Zara the Slayer ... Amazon, Dwarf, Norse, or Human ... 270,000

Clarification: Zara's Stakes will effect ANY player on a Khemri, Necromantic, Undead, or Vampire team.
===========================================================================
Thank you for participating in the 2004 Chaos Cup.

IMPORTANT!
Competitors are advised that from the moment of entry into the event the decisions of all Judges,
Referees and members of Games Workshop staff regarding the fair adjudication of the Tournament rules,
and all issues of health and safety, are final. No discussions will be entered into once a decision
is taken. This applies to rules adjudications, the scores applied for any category of the Tournament,
painting judging, and any issues that require the cooperation of the competitors. Once the Tournament
results are published, we cannot alter them in any way. Any breach of this will be considered a Red
Card offence at the Tournament.

If you have any questions regarding the event then please email: joe.krone@games-workshop.com with
Chaos Cup Tournament in the subject heading.

ENTRY TICKET
Tickets will be available for purchase the day of the tournament. The tournament will cost $10 and
unless players bring extra boards we will only have space for 40 players so make sure you arrive early.

THINGS YOU NEED TO BRING
??? Your Chaos Cup rules pack (these pages)
??? Your PAINTED team
??? Two copies of your team roster (one of these must be given to the Chaos Cup organizers when you register)
??? Blocking dice, D6 and D8 dice
??? Throw-in, Scatter and Pass templates
??? Turn Markers, Reroll Counters, and a game ball (painted).
??? A Blood Bowl pitch (if you want). We have 20 boards so unless some players bring boards we will
sell out the tournament at 40 players.
??? Pen & paper
??? Your NAF number (if you have one). This tournament is NAF sanctioned. If you want to join the NAF
BEFORE the tournament, go to http://www.bloodbowl.net
??? If possible as well, a Living Rule Book (LRB) 3.0 print-out or Blood Bowl Handbook

THE VENUE
The tournament will be held at Chicago Battle Bunker in 1524A Butterfield Rd, Downer???s Grove, Illinois, 60515
on November 6th. Phone Number: 630-426-0120
For more detailed information, go to http://www.adeptuswindycity.com for the event or email Joe Krone,
GW Midwest Promotions Manager at joe.krone@games-workshop.com


SCHEDULE
9.00am-10.00am Entry and Registration
10.00am-Noon Game 1
Noon-1.00pm Lunch Break
1.00pm-3.00pm Game 2
3.00pm-3.30pm Break
3.30pm-5.30pm Game 3
5:30pm-6:30pm Supper Break
6:30pm-8:30pm Game 4
8:30pm-9:15pm Break/Calculate Final Standings
9:15pm-9:45pm Awards/Wrap-Up

Please be on time for registration, you HAVE to be ready to begin by 10am, NO LATER! As you can see the
timetable is quite tight so I would ask that you play at a brisk pace. If your opponent is taking a long
time for his turn then remind him that the four minute rule is in play. The schedule is subject to change
if the event organisers need to.

FORMAT
The Tournament is played over just Saturday. You will participate in a series of four games. After each
game you will play against a different opponent. In the first round, players will be matched randomly
against an opponent. After that, in each round the two players in 1st and 2nd place (based on their
points for coaching) will play each other, the players in 3rd and 4th place will play each other,
the players in 5th and 6th place will play each other, and so on. The only exception is that you can
never play the same opponent twice; should this happen a referee will step in and sort things out so
that the players face fresh opponents of a suitable calibre. This usually means moving you either up
or down the tables to swap you around - it isn't THAT critical as to exactly which table you're on,
as long as you play a relatively well-matched opponent. Once your opponent has been determined you
will be assigned a table. The event organisers will provide no other games equipment and the players
must provide all other materials. You must bring along a copy of the Blood Bowl rules, as well as
copies of any material you will be using so that your opponent can check any special rules and
characteristics that apply to your team.

To keep on schedule, we would appreciate it if you could play at quite a brisk pace with no time wasting please!

Each player has a special results card. Once you've finished your game, you must fill in the card and
then hand it in at the information desk. It is important you fill all the information in as this will
decide your ranking and ultimately the winner of the Tournament. Your results will then be entered into
the tournament database.

THE AWARDS
As well as the Blood Bowl winner, 2nd and 3rd place, other prizes will be awarded for Best Sportsman,
Best Painted Team, Most Touchdowns, Fewest Touchdowns Allowed, and Most Casualties Caused.

THE TOURNAMENT RULES
The rules from the latest edition of the Living Rulebook (available free from www.BloodBowl.com) are
to be used unless specifically stated below.

Only the official teams as of the 2003 rules review AND the Ogre and Vampire teams may be entered.
To clarify so there is no doubt these are: Human, Orc, Dwarf, High Elf, Skaven, Dark Elf, Chaos,
Undead, Chaos Dwarf, Goblin, Halfling, Wood Elf, Norse, Lizardman, Khemri, Nurgle, Necromantic, Elf and Amazon.
With Ogres and Vampires allowed as well.

No other teams are allowed. Teams must be written out on the official Blood Bowl team roster pad or
through any of the numerous software programs available for team sheet creation. You must bring two copies,
give one to the officials at registration and keep the other for your own reference.

Make sure your team is correct as team rosters will be checked. Any mistakes found after registration
(even if not deliberate) will result in that player getting a yellow card.

REFEREES
The primary purpose of our Tournament is to get together for the day, so that we can play our favourite
game and meet other players who share our interests. Finding 'champion players' of our games is a
by-product of this, and we're really much more interested in creating a quality gaming experience for
all the people that take part, where they get to play lots of games and meet a whole bunch of new players.

This being said we do understand that sometimes even the friendliest of players can lose their cool,
especially if the dice have been going against them all day. The most common causes of friction in a
game are questions about the rules of the game. Rules questions arise in most games of Blood Bowl,
both because the huge number of variables involved in the game make it just about impossible for the
rulebook to cover every situation that might occur, and because different people interpret the rules
in different ways. In order to avoid arguments we recommend that you refer to the appropriate rulebook
as soon as a question arises. If the rules do not cover the situation, then roll a dice to decide what
happens. In other words, a friendly dice roll should decide any question that cannot be answered by
referring to the rules.

Please note that there is absolutely nothing wrong with asking an opponent if they can show you the
appropriate rule or set of characteristics so that you can check for yourself that everything is being
done correctly. All we require is that you ask nicely and politely, and that you do your best to sort
out any problems yourselves!

If you really want a Referee to sort out a rules question, then you are free to call one over, and our
Referees may intervene if they see an argument. Be warned, however, that our Referees are under strict
instructions to give players one of two answers to any question they are asked:

1. They will show you the rule in its relevant place in the rulebook.

2. To roll a D6 to sort out any rules problems not solved by the above. You should also note that the
prime duty of our Referees is to make sure that the majority of players in the tournament get a nice
friendly game where winning is secondary to having a good time. Anyone who keeps on spoiling a game with
picky rules questions or who consistently bends the rules in their favour will be asked to desist or
suffer the consequences.

Referees will have a simple card system to adjudicate this kind of ruling:

YELLOW: A Yellow Card will be shown to the player(s) and their player number and name logged. In addition,
50 points will be taken from a booked player's Tournament totals.

RED: A Red Card will be shown to the player(s) and their player number and name logged. In addition,
100 points will be taken from a booked player's Tournament totals.

The decision of the Chief Referee is final, and no discussion will be entered into. Arguing with the
Chief Referee following a decision will be a RED CARD offence


Galak


Last edited by GalakStarscraper on Sep 28, 2004 - 12:34 PM; edited 1 time in total
 
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Zombie
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 01:06 PM



Joined: Oct 24, 2003

Posts: 1671

The vault sneaking into GW tournaments. That's one more tournament i certainly won't attend. Not that i'd want to attend a one-day tournament anyway...

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They will slowly add bits of the vault in on each RR leading up to 2007, starting with LRB 4.0, so it will be a slow and agonising death for BB.
 
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SpazzfistOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 02:04 PM



Joined: Aug 16, 2004
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      Zombie wrote:
The vault sneaking into GW tournaments. That's one more tournament i certainly won't attend. Not that i'd want to attend a one-day tournament anyway...


Jeez Zombie, didn't your mama tell you what you should do if you don't have something nice to say? Rolling Eyes

Sounds like a lot of fun guys, and it looks like you put a lot of thought into this one! I will see what I can do about attending!


Spazz

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GalakStarscraperOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 02:08 PM
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Xtreme ... if you want to ... I'll split the ride up to the tournament with you and the cost of a room the night before.

I'm going up late though ... like leaving Indy at 9:00 pm. But if you are interested let me know. Its another shot for your Ogres to compete for Best Painted and get some more game in.

I'm trying to convert the Treemen for my Fling team since the Ogres are no longer street legal.

And Zombie ... just for the record the above isn't the Vault slipping into GW tournaments ... those items above were changes that were coming to the LRB 4.0 WAY before the Vault was ever even a suggestion.

Galak
 
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TrogOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 02:46 PM



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Sounds good, we've got a group coming up from Springfield, MO on Friday.

Looking forward to it.
 
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Zombie
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 03:12 PM



Joined: Oct 24, 2003

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      GalakStarscraper wrote:
And Zombie ... just for the record the above isn't the Vault slipping into GW tournaments ... those items above were changes that were coming to the LRB 4.0 WAY before the Vault was ever even a suggestion.


All i know is that they weren't at the Spike!, and i'm glad they weren't!

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GalakStarscraperOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 03:13 PM
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      Spazzfist wrote:
it looks like you put a lot of thought into this one! I will see what I can do about attending!
Those rules the Chaos Cup is using should look familar to some tournament players.

Galak
 
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CyberHare
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 03:33 PM



Joined: Feb 12, 2003

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      GalakStarscraper wrote:
Those rules the Chaos Cup is using should look familar to some tournament players.


Yeah I seem to recognize that painting points system from somewhere Smile

I think they're giving a few too many points for it though. But then I guess GW wants to put more emphasis on the painting aspect of the hobby than the game play. Not a bad thing just not the way I would have done it. That's the beauty of the tourney system that is evelvng though. It can be used for many tournament setups and give each their own individual flair simply by changing the points value for different area's of the game.

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GalakStarscraperOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 03:56 PM
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      CyberHare wrote:
I think they're giving a few too many points for it though.


I guess I don't see the painting points as really having that much impact overall. In the system in total you have this break down:

Points from games (average): 81%
Points from sportsmanship: 14%
Points from painting: 5%

Using the points from the last tournament using this system it broke down this way for 4 games when you total all the player points that played all 4 games (46 total players ... 41 players finishing all 4 games)

Points from games: 79%
Points from sportsmanship: 15%
Points from painting: 6%

Out of the top 6 players out of the 46:

Points from games (average): 83%
Points from sportsmanship: 12%
Points from painting: 5%

========================================

The other factor I look at is that only 10 of the 46 players received less than the full 15 points for painting and of those 10 ... the only player in the top 20 where the 5 or more points he lost from painting matter would have moved him from 19th to 18th place in the tournament.

You could in theory lose a tournament with this system if you showed up with really poorly painted figs ... but practically speaking ... its not a big risk item. The ranking system that Underworld Cup uses has a much bigger chance of causing changes to ranking in a tournament based on painting since it quite easy to lose painting points with the method John uses.

Galak
 
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Zombie
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 04:03 PM



Joined: Oct 24, 2003

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You can't look at it this way. If a loss was worth 210 points and a win was worth 255 points, then of course people would get more points on average for their games than for their painting. But the total points for grabs for a single game would still only be 45 points, the other 210 points being handed out for free. You could say these 210 points are given for writing your name down on your roster for all it's worth, and then say that putting your name down is what provided the most points. In fact, it didn't provide any points at all and neither did a loss.

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Zombie
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 04:12 PM



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The truth of the matter is that at the chaos cup, there will be

45 x 4 points up for grabs for winning
20 x 4 points up for grabs for CAS and TD bonuses
10 x 4 points up for grabs for sportsmanship
15 points up for grabs for painting
for a possible total of 315 points, plus the 52 free points given out to everyone.

That's
57% for winning games
25% for scoring TDs and CAS
13% for sportsmanship
5% for painting.

Arguably that's close to what you posted because only 52 of 367 points are given out for free and shouldn't count in the calculation, but it's still worth pointing out how things should be calculated.

_________________
They will slowly add bits of the vault in on each RR leading up to 2007, starting with LRB 4.0, so it will be a slow and agonising death for BB.


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GalakStarscraperOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 04:19 PM
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I agree your math is more accurate Zombie ... I think you've got one small hole in the math though.

There is an additional 12 free points from sportsmanship as everyone gets that many for a total of 52 free points in the system you get just for playing 4 games in the tournament (ie as you put it signing your name).

I would also argue that 6 of the 15 points for painting are free since all you have to do to get those is show up with the right team (since bare metal teams can get the 6 points for Representation ... I would hope that folks could do this much ... but I'll agree that it is possible to lose even these so they are not truely free).

But for the points up for grabs I agree ... however ... as you stated ... even with better math ... your numbers and mine are within 1% point of each other.

Galak


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Zombie
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 04:22 PM



Joined: Oct 24, 2003

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Since Brian is making the argument that painting has too much value, let's compare this with his Death Bowl and see what transpires :

30 x 5 + 10 points for winning games
20 x 5 points for CAS and TD bonuses
4 x 6 points for sportsmanship
10 points for painting
for a total of 296 points plus 116 given away for free to everyone.

This gives us :
54% for winning games
34% for TDs and CAS
8% for sportsmanship
3% for painting

What i see here is that Brian likes to give more weight to bonuses and less to sportsmanship and painting.

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Zombie
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 04:24 PM



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      GalakStarscraper wrote:
There is an additional 12 free points from sportsmanship as everyone gets that many.


You're right, i forgot those. This means 52 free points total instead of 40. I'll change it now. However, since free points don't (and shouldn't) enter into consideration, that doesn't change anything else in the post.

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GalakStarscraperOffline
Post subject:   PostPosted: Sep 27, 2004 - 04:40 PM
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      Zombie wrote:
What i see here is that Brian likes to give more weight to bonuses and less to sportsmanship and painting.


Hmmm actually if you look at the % changes ... he taking from every category to pump up extras ... that's fine ... as he said different tournament stress different things. But I don't believe a 1.4% difference in painting points is a major difference point in painting points allowed between the Chaos Cup and the Death Bowl ... at least not enough that I think it deserved comment there Brian .. Laughing Wink

Change from Chaos Cup to the Death Bowl
-2.7% for winning games
+8.6% for TDs and CAS
-4.5% for sportsmanship
-1.4% for painting

Galak
 
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